How To Find a Fulfilling Career, Chat with Mallory Loone

Yasi: Today I have Mallory Loone with me, and she’s the co-founder of Work inspired, a people management and development company that has worked with many fortune 500 companies both locally and abroad and her knowledge and expertise is in the people development and have earned her recognition of Malaysia’s most talented coach and also top 100 global training and development coach of the year.

 Last year, she was recognized as the top 100 LinkedIn icons to follow in Malaysia, by marketing in Asia and was a three time TED speaker. What achievement, Mallory! 

Mallory Loone: Thank you. Thank you. And nice to have you and thanks for having me here as well. Thank you so much. Nice to meet you, Yasi. 

Yasi: Yeah. Nice meeting you too. And let me greet you as the usual one. Welcome to the Fast Track podcast. 

Mallory Loone: Thank you. Thank you.

Yasi: And today we’re going to talk about how to find a fulfilling career. That’s the, I think, main topic a lot of millennials, young professionals are struggling with nowadays, but let’s start with your personal story. How did you find your fulfilling career? How did you end up with your company Work Inspires?

Mallory Loone: Yeah, I think our backtrack a bit and summarize it a little. We actually started when I was graduating university because I studied BCCA, that stands for professional competency. Okay. I’m from an Asian family. So in Asian culture, we commonly have this thing about the lawyers, engineers or accountant. I’m not sure you really know that.

My biology didn’t score so well, so forget a doctor I’m horrible at maths for an engineer. I really hate law, so forget lawyer. I guess I was stuck in a conference, so that’s how I started. But along the studies, I realized that I’m not really suitable for the job. I think graduate, but I’m not really suitable for a financial job.

And I actually became very adamant because I grew up in an environment where I hear a lot of people talking about I hit my boss. They come home from work and they complain about a boss, company everyday, and they became so tiring to listen to. And because of that, when I was graduating, I was a very staggered person that says, you know what, I am really going to get a job that I love.

I wanted that. I didn’t know it’s called culture. I just know I wanted to get a job that I love. So I became very I remember for a job with abuse and I started looking at things that I would see fulfilling, for example, like culture, for example, the boss i’m working with, for example, the engagements that it have, that development programs that they have.

And little that I know I found myself in a position where I like people relate their stuff. Everything people relate them. In a interview HR manager actually gave me a very good advice. He told me that Mallory, I don’t think financial is a place for you. I think you should do something people related.

And that conversation, even though it was very painful to hear, because I studied for years. At the end I realized that, okay, I should start the people, which also ended up how as that the in entrepreneurship, because I didn’t know why I want it. So how I found a fulfilling career is actually because I lost, I just didn’t know what I wanted to do.

So I started as a project director for entrepreneurship platform, which allows me to work in every area for my strength and that’s how I ended up loving business. So I found my love in growing businesses. Now what Ms. Baez cake, because about three years ago, I was building a business with my last business partner and I reached a point where I really understood what unfulfilling business is.

So another reality check is that you can be building a business, and yet be very stressed out. You can build a business and be mentally, physically exhausted. You can build a business and sacrifice a life in between. So that’s also what happened to me. About three, four years ago, when I was building a business. About my fifth year in, I was reaching the point where I suffered insomnia.

I couldn’t sleep well. I was sleeping and dreaming of proposals. Have I submitted this proposal? And I wake up in the three o’clock and I checked my email and I go, oh yes, okay. That was my life. I can wake up, I can sleep seven hours, go to the office and then I lay on a table and sleep. Because I was just tired and that was a reality check for me.

 When it came to a point where my business partner and I were in very different direction I decided to say to myself, okay, maybe it’s time for a change. So I sold my shares. I left the business and I took a rest before I really tried to find again, was fulfilling business that I was looking for or fulfillingin life i was looking for.

At that point I was 27 years. So it was, as you know in Asia we tend to have this by 30. You need to get married at the time, buy a house, get a card, everything.

Yasi: It’s universal. 

Mallory Loone: It’s a universal thing because a universal millennial problem. So when I was reaching 27, mental breakdown and go, am I failing, what is this?

Am I there or am i not there? And when I had to make a middle point in my life, where do I want to start a job? Or do I want to build a business again? I decided to go back to business because I wanted to build a business that can give people satisfaction. And I want a business that makes myself truly happy.

So if you asked me, hey, Mallory, what makes a fulfilling business or fulfilling career, is: one- that even though you are going through very difficult days, you find it worth it. So that to me now is fulfilling. 

Yasi: That’s a very great sentence. I’m going to mark it and I want to rewind back a little bit.

How did you start a business at such a young age? Because I’m sure a lot of people are still trying to find another job, get a promotion. What makes you have this courage to start your own business? 

Mallory Loone: I think I’m not sure, was it courage or was i stubborn? I have to decide a bit about that. My first job was when I was graduating, when I say I was this project director, I did a good job.

So it was actually a paid job. I had a salary, the only differences, because it’s like a view NGO. So I get to write my own job description. I didn’t have a boss that controlled me a lot. So Mallory, regular description bit about what time do you want to sleep, what time you want off, that kind of a lifestyle. So it was really good.

I traveled a lot. I was every state in Asia and across the world. So I really enjoyed myself. But when the contract ended, when you’re in that, turning point where I decide, where do I want to get another job, or do I want to start a business. At that point, I asked myself, What is the biggest thing I could lose?

So at that point I was at an age of 22, maybe and I was thinking, okay, I’m not married yet. So I don’t have any financial or children commitments and that. I’m quite blessed that my family is doing pretty sufficient. Okay. I wouldn’t say doing great, but sufficient, I will still have to do my responsibility as elders and my family, but it was a good opportunity to try and see if this works out.

But being an accountant, I was very realistic, so I set a benchmark for myself – Mallory in the next year or so if we don’t get this, then you’re going to get a job. But because I set a deadline, I worked really hard to make sure that I get to keep what I want and also build a business that I enjoy.

Yasi: Also my respect to you from age of 22, you mentioned you built a business and work on it for five years. And at that time, after you sold your shares, have you ever thought about taking another high paying position in a big company or what were your options at that time?

Mallory Loone: Yeah. I actually had quite enough clients that plants that I was working with. Send me an email saying that Mallory, we have this vacancy. I actually went for a couple of interviews as well. Because I was thinking maybe I could get a hype-y job instead. And then I realized after i had four, I think five or six interviews across different companies, I realized that I really enjoy strategising. 

 I enjoy building things. And when you’re actually working for somebody, a lot of things are beyond your control. As much as they empower you, but let’s take this dynamic for example, it will be time where there are things beyond your control and those things beyond your control are a good opportunity to get past or something you wanted to drive can drive through things of that happened.

So after five to six interviews, most of my clients, which are also friends and our clients today again, they told me, Mallory, maybe it’s good that you continue running a business or start a business because I feel you can get more value. Because when your employee, you have to, unfortunately by rest of the moves, cultures, politics, things like that.

And you need to manage the different stakeholders, changes a bit harder, but when you’re coming here as a consultant, you can actually advocate for proper changes. You can actually make real impact across companies. So that’s the advice I took and I’m going to share something personal here. I didn’t really share a lot of.

 When I was really deciding I was praying God, please help me to make a good decision because at 27, I’d rather be not failing, than wondering what to do in life. And I had a very interesting dream. So I dreamt of this lady I’ve never met, who ran a lot of workshops, helping startups to grow the business.

Okay. She’s an Indonesian lady, now I met her. And halfway through, she was diagnosed with cancer. Until the day she passed away, she was really driving as much impact when she passed away. A lot of people carry on her work. And in that dream, I was dreaming that I was going for a cancer marker test, or I didn’t know the results.

So don’t ask me. But when I woke up, I had that huge moment in my life that made me wonder. If you are only going to live, maybe you are already going to live this one life, right? What is the best legacy you want to leave behind? And what is the message you want to send out to other people who come to you?

And that was when I decided to start the business again. And I was hoping because my mom is very worried about me. And she’s a very caring parent and we know how is it like, so when I woke up and she came into my room at seven in the morning, she came Mallory, you focus six months break. Have you decided what you want to do in life?

And I just looked at her half the way and I go, what do you think if I start another business? And just okay, go for it. To my at most surprise. Because for the first business, she was definitely against it, but I was oh, it’s a sign. I’ll take it. And that’s how out of a personal life this happened. 

Yasi: What a very interesting dream.

I think I also talked, like interviewed other guests. I think sometimes people came to a moment, awakening moment, you realize like what you really want to do. Recently, I started to think more often if I’m going to die soon, if I look back what I have done today in my life, right?

What have I done? I work, I sleep, I work, I sleep, I travel. What else I have done with my life? That I started to think I have already lived. What legacy I have left behind same as what you have said. And this leads to another concept you talk about earlier to me of this chat is about Ikigai.

Can you tell the audience what is Ikigai, and how did you find your Ikigai or how the audience can find their Ikigai? 

Mallory Loone: If you read a whole book, Ikigai covers a lot of concepts, I’m just going to summarize it. That basically in English terms, if you turn your passion into work and you have fulfillment while also giving back, you’re somewhat achieved Ikigai concept.

Personally, for me, I think Ikigai is something that’s always a way progress. Because we change. When I first started, I had this idea that I wanted to be a speaker or trainer, really focusing on that. And now, as I ran the business more, I got very much as a personal growth.

After a while, I became very good at certain things. I may, as much as you’re always growing, you got good at certain things. And you realized that it was your own next level. So even as entrepreneurs or business owners, or even your CEO for the better, you always need to ask what’s the next level of growth.

That’s why CEOs change companies, because you want to ask yourself what’s the next level of growth. So for me, the Ikigai concept of change , as long as I have an opportunity to keep learning, improving. So when I first started, I just wanted to help young people find a passion. That’s the only reason why I started the first business.

I wanted to help people like me who were lost in their studies to figure out life. But as I started working with companies, I realized that there’s this phrase that really capture my attention: Are you living, or are you merely existing? Are you really alive, living life or are you just the person living.

Yasi: Yeah, correct. 

Mallory Loone: So which one are you? So I really had that. When I work with a lot of companies, especially now I notice a lot of that and a lot of young people, which is quite sad. When they join the company, they’re full of life. They go oh, they want to work. They go to picture for Instagram, TikTok , all kinds of things.

And then you see six months down the road, it’ll look like a zombie. And then one year down the road, they are thinking what’s life. Two years down the road, it’s element free. I want to change all. I’m not sure what I’m doing anymore. And when you ask them, how are you doing? It’s so sad when you ask people, how are you doing, the answer should be great, or doing this. They start saying surviving. And I’m like, that’s not an answer. What is surviving? So when now that I’m growing more, I want to always focus on where can I build an advent? So it could be like what you’re doing on this podcast. And I want to challenge myself, want to see what are the aspects of companies that get help rather than just, it’s easy to move a person, but it’s hard to move a company.

So it’s getting reached a point where you can influence because the work that you do is good. That’s the level we’re now. 

Yasi: Wow. Amazing. And I can so much relate to that. I also interviewed Veronica in my first episode and she was a banker and a later on, she became a coach as well, personal development coach or life coach.

And also I interview like a Faisal. He was also working in investment bank and now he’s a life coach and also so many people that change career to find something else that’s more meaningful. So I want to ask you for, through your workshops or your works with companies and individuals, what are the most common mistakes people are making if they still feel that they are surviving? What they have done wrong? 

Mallory Loone: I think the one either to put the first mistake you’ve made is you got comfortable. It’s like saying that you know there’s something wrong, but you don’t want to admit there’s something wrong. And you use the excuse of, oh, it’s the pandemic, it’s hard to get a job these days, but I’m already so old. What about life? I should just be focusing on retiring now by such a breeze. I’ve studied this course. Not if I don’t do something similar, otherwise study is a waste of time. I studied BCCN, and i’m entrepreneur. All of these are excuses, but the only reason why you allow yourself to keep falling into this is because something’s off somewhere, but you don’t want to seek help about it.

And when you don’t talk to someone about it, no one can give you guidance. So the key thing in life is like we say, you don’t know what you don’t know. So hence why you always have to keep searching, right? You always have to keep learning. And that’s why podcasts like this exists as well, so that you can learn.

And the only way for it to learn is to first admit that something’s wrong and I need help. It’s like a denial phase, I think that I’m no smoker, that i need to quit or alcoholic, I need to quit – same concept. So now you are a deprived workaholic, but you’re not accepting that. You’re just saying that, oh because I don’t have good education, because I don’t have a good certification, because I didn’t get a good grade, or because I’m really in this job so long. I’ve seen people who independently change jobs and they were not a superstar student, I myself failed how many papers? Numerous times before I graduated. Somebody who actually lost my job, and my first job because of the politics. So I’m a superstar somewhere.

I have a lot of failures in my life. So any difference is that I’m willing to say, I’m not good, and i wanna learn. So the first mistake a lot of people make is that, and the second mistake is they don’t take time to find who they are. It’s like when you do that, you ask the classic question. What would you like to eat for lunch or dinner?

And everybody answered anything, I don’t know, up to you. You’re not even put the effort to think. Did tell me what would you like to eat? No, you’re not putting any effort. You’re just giving you a reflex answer, I don’t know, anything, up to you. So today, when I ask you, if you don’t like the job that you’re in, or you don’t like the best dessert, whatever it is, I don’t like something alive.

What would you like? Most of us can’t answer the question because we don’t even ask ourself who are you? What do you like? What do you don’t like? So those two are top two reasons why you are stuck at this circle of misery. 

Yasi: I agree with you so much, and this is one of my favorite sentences you just mentioned, you don’t know what you don’t know, actually applies anywhere in any situation.

And let’s also start with self-awareness which back to your second point, like if people leave their daily life, go to the office and come back home, watch TV and sleep and go to the office, come back home, watch TV and sleep. They never really pay attention to the inner voice.

They are not self aware. What do you like? What you don’t like, what brings you joy? What brings you fulfillment? They’re just so used to the daily routine. I think this is like a key point that once you are more self aware, you know what you like, you know what you don’t like, and then you can take action to change that.

And then back to your first point – do not get comfortable. And do you have any examples to share with us from your work, from your trainig that you see the transformation and the people reaching a fulfilling career? 

Mallory Loone: I can share two examples first and then I’ll top it myself.

So one example would be advantage coach. So he is somebody that really loves like really love financial freedom, investment related anything. He’s somebody that spends hours and efforts trying to figure out what works. That’s called passionate navigation. Now where he was graduated, his dad was diagnosed with stroke.

So requires a lot of medication. He’s a scholarship student. So he came to me and said, Mallory, I have to keep up my dream, to start my own investment fund. And I said, why? Because my dad is not well, so I need to take care of family. Understandable. And I told him, all right, if let’s say, if that’s the case let’s say we don’t get rid of the dream.

We just postpone it. What do you need to do today to work towards that dream? And then he came up with a plan and told me, okay, I need to get a job that pays well, so I can save enough money for my dad’s medical reasons. Very clear. And then I need back in that job besides just pay, the job also need to teach skills I need to start my investment business. And that’s it very good. The third things missing. And he said, what? Timeline. If we don’t set deadlines for ourselves, the next thing is that five years, 10 years gone by and you have not started anything. And by 5 or 10 years you’ve probably been married with children.

Then you want to ask yourself, okay, I should focus on my children’s dream. And then that’s why the number one reasons or regret that people have is they don’t get to fulfill their dreams. So I told him to set a timeline. It’s okay, circumstances can change. You can change the timeline, but most importantly, you set it.

And he said, okay, I’ll give myself three years. Three years are this year in March, which is two and a half years after his graduation. He sent me an email saying, Mallory, this is a screenshot of my letter of resignation. I’ve had enough money to pay for my dad’s medical bill. I’ve gotten the sufficient knowledge and I’ve started my business.

So I’m going to go on it full-time after this, I hope you’ll continue supporting me. And that was two and a half years ago. So imagine if let’s say rewind back to three years ago, if that boy decided that you know what, I’m going to give up on a dream and I’m not going to put any effort to it, then he would not even be near to what he is today. The moment you give up a hundred percent, but if you give let’s try and see, what’s the worst that can happen. It’s just all going to work out. You have a 50:50 chance. So that’s the first example. Somebody that I think a lot of you who give up dreams of families, which is very understandable because of course, whether we should take care of as a responsible children, you want to take care of parents.

So this is something a lot of you can relate to. And I think something that shows that maybe you don’t have to cancel, you just have to postpone. And the second example would be somebody I know who is at 55 years old. So this person has been working his entire life in the bank, moving from anywhere to where he is today, and he’s very successful.

And then pandemic happened and he was given a separation scheme where you thank you for so much for your service. And when he received, because it’s been working for life, the, some he be singles quite a lot. Then this is an example of somebody who doesn’t have a dream. It’s a lot of times, right? We had dreams of a young, but we don’t keep our plan or go asking yourself what we want when we are growing to retirement.

So when he received a huge amount of sound for thank you for your service, he didn’t know what to do. At 55, despite this as two children went to college, everything’s up there, he got into depression with a lot of money. Cause if you didn’t know what to do, and in that point, it’s a lot harder to help somebody to kick start thinking it’s okay. If 55 you can still dream.

Yasi: Yeah, midlife crisis. 

Mallory Loone: Literally midlife crisis. So I think two lessons to share is: the number one – yes, there are things the other control, but dreams or your goals can always be postponed, doesn’t mean it’s canceled. And number two, it’s never too late to start anything. So don’t let age be a factor, but on the other hand, this is also why you should always learn, like I said, keep looking for what fulfillment is in different stages of a life so that you won’t hit a point where I do not know what life is, even tho you lived 50 years of your life. 

Yasi: And also there’s another question I like to ask myself frequently and also for the audience, maybe let’s take a moment, let the audience answer themselves.

If money is not a problem, would you still be doing what you’re doing now? 

Mallory Loone: be doing more what i’m doing now if money were not a problem. 

Yasi: And also, do you agree with me that I read in so many places that if you are doing not for the sake of the money, but for sake of passion, money will come as a result? 

Mallory Loone: I do completely agree with that sentence. Okay. I’m not saying that money is not important. Everybody is saying money doesn’t buy happiness.

I think there’s two set of points. Because when you’re sick money do pay the bills, but if you work without loving your job, that’s the reason why you’re sick. So it’s two sides of the same coin , people say. But one thing I like to share is that a lot of people tend to have this notion that money means evil. 

Like money is the ruler, all kind of thing. I dunno why, but I’ve been taught this thing over time. If you are successful, that things come. If you are rich and don’t give back, that things comes like karma system. But let me clarify this. Money is not the root of all evil. The people that manage the money is the reason why they get evil.

 So Money doesn’t do anything. Money is just energy. And just because you have passion, there’s a need, you cannot have money at the same time. And the one bit to add onto that as well as that you don’t need to do every single day for money. I give example, right? Like today I charge my clients. So I do earn money from companies and I get satisfaction from helping companies get their results.

I get paid, but I also give back to society through mentoring students for free, I coach for free, I help start-ups for free. So I don’t mind giving advice and talk to people and share mindsets for free as my sense of fulfillment. It doesn’t mean that oh, just because you’re going to help the world, Mallory, you cannot charge a single cent because there are a lot of people to help. Yes. But if I can’t help myself, putting the oxygen mask on you first. 

Yasi: Money is evil. It’s like a misconception I think is taught in many families. I talk so much about money, my mindset is on Fast Track money course.

I can talk way more, but I will save our other topics. I want to ask you one last question. If there’s some key message you would like to leave to the audience who are young professionals, who are out in that job and who is very capable, competitive looking to achieve more in life, what kind of advice would you give them to help them find the fulfilling career?

Mallory Loone: Yeah, I think I will sum up with three areas of what makes a fool. Okay. One is that you have a sense of belonging where you’re in. All right. A lot of times the team, the people that you work with is the reason why you stay in organization, because there’s a sense of family outside of home. So that’s the first area.

So wherever you’re at now, do you find that. Then the second criteria to look for is, are you growing? A lot of people like to say this, Mallory I’ll leave the job. And I told them you would never leave, because you always learn something every day. But the question is, are you growing. Not just learning. So that’s the second part.

All right. And the third part would be coming back to what gives you the ultimate fulfillment. Some of us will eventually have goals that you wanted to be purchased. Some of us, we eventually have goals that maybe you want to be mother staying home, just taking care of the children or fathers staying home take your children, which is perfectly fine as well.

So whatever you’re at right now, does it need to get ultimate fulfillment for you of what life is? And it doesn’t always have to be success in the world’s eyes. Like for me, I just want to travel. You know this because to me.

God created a very beautiful world for us to explore if you never get to see for a day. So I want to spend a lot of time in my trouble, so very high right now. So hence why, if for me fulfillment career covers these three points. If this three can be met that slightly or somewhat Ikigai in fulfillment.

Yasi: Very well. So thank you so much for being here. Mallory. 

Mallory Loone: Thank you so much for having me and stay safe. They care.